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There are contactless thermometers, the Nose Frieda, co-sleeping. Trends in parenting gear and childrearing practices seem to evolve at faster rates than other sectors, a speed exemplified by a single product: strollers.

While we’ve been engineering ways to wheel children around for centuries, stroller manufacturers can’t seem to stop iterating on their models. Strollers have become a status identifier, a repository for parenting anxiety, and an emblem of consumerism run amok. As doctors and experts gather new research and best practices in childcare, strollers exemplify how quickly it’s all changing.

Featuring

Rocio Fabbro is a staff writer at Quartz and the host of Season 8 of the Quartz Obsession podcast. She’s obsessed with etymology, matcha, and late ’90s-early ’00s romcoms.

Jamie Grayson is a dual-certified CPST and internationally-recognized baby gear expert with 20 years experience in the industry.

Jen LaBracio is Babylist’s Senior Gear Editor, a role that perfectly combines her love of all things baby gear with her love of (obsessive) research.

Show notes

The Jamie Grayson

Jen LaBracio - Senior Gear Editor, Babylist 

A $3,300 self-driving stroller is at this year’s CES. Are parents ready?

Where it all began: celebrating 20 years of Bugaboo

Kourtney Kardashian Highlights Baby Rocky’s Stylish Stroller — Which Was Designed by Jeremy Scott 

Buybuy BABY reopens locations in NY, NJ and CT after closing all stores amid Bed Bath and Beyond bankruptcy

Transcript

Rocio: Let’s start with a little game of “What Am I?” I’m a $3,300 marvel of modern parenting powered by artificial intelligence to make strolling a breeze. But if that’s too pricey, you can rent my self-driving cousin at Disney World for just $500 a day. Can you guess what I am? Ponder that for a moment while I introduce the guests who will take us through today’s obsession.

Joining me today are two brilliant minds in the baby gear world. First, we have Jamie Grayson, aka The Baby Guy, a certified child passenger safety technician and internationally recognized baby gear expert. Welcome, Jamie.

Jamie: Hello, how’s it going?

Rocio: Good, good. Happy to have you here. And we also have Jen LaBracio, senior gear editor at BabyList, who spends her days testing and reviewing the latest and greatest in baby gear. Great to have you here, Jen.

Jen: Hi, thank you so much for having me.

Rocio: Okay, the moment of truth. I am the Ella Smart Stroller by Glüxkind Technologies. Well, actually, I’m Rocio Fabbro, and I’m your host of Season 8 of The Quartz Obsession, where we’re taking a closer look at the technologies and ideas that define our lives.

Today we’re exploring the riveting world of strollers. Now I have to ask, had either of you heard of this AI-powered stroller before?

Jamie: I have. I’ve not seen it in person. I’ve seen a similar product in person, but I, I’m very aware that it exists.

Jen: Yes, I have heard of it as well, but I also have not seen it in person. I’d be very curious to see it in person and to give it a test drive, or shall I say to let it drive itself. But no, I have not had my hands on it yet.

Rocio: Let’s take our listeners back to a time before AI and self-driving strollers. How long have strollers been around and how have they evolved over time?

Jamie: The first, as far as I know, the first stroller company that ever made like a proper pram is Silver Cross. And they, I’ve been to their headquarters in the UK, and they have like one of their old like first refurbished strollers and it’s really, really cool to see. And I believe they started in like 1877.

Jen: Yeah, I was gonna say, I think mid- to late-1800s, and we have to credit the Brits, like we do with many things. And it was more of, I mean, I’ve seen several early-ish models, but I think the one that people might recognize the most would be like a pram style with like the very large metal wheels and like the bassinet style, you know, seat or whatever you would call it for the baby.

Jamie: They’re enormous.

Rocio: Yeah, I was gonna ask, how do those compare to now what we see on the sidewalks today?

Jamie: I mean, a lot of strollers now have, like, bassinet attachments, so, like, the DNA is kind of there, but very few people get, like, the giant prams in North America just because they’re not that practical, because you can’t really fold them down.

They’re just, like, a, they’re a third or fourth car for a lot of people. But, yeah, the higher end strollers with bassinets and, like, suspension, the DNA is.

Jen: I would agree with that. Same thing. I mean, they’ve changed in many, many ways. I think now, like, suspension, people are very into suspension, and that wasn’t something that you even thought about.

I actually had to do a voiceover for a TikTok we did for BabyList, and it was like, look at this old baby gear, and sort of, like, comment on what you think about it, and one of them was this, like, metal, sort of, it almost looked like one of those carts that you push if you live in the city to, like, carry your groceries.

But it had a baby just in it. And very far cry from what you see now. Much more tech forward now, much more focused on things like suspension, fold, comfort, breathability, fabric, all that stuff.

Rocio: Totally. And so, you said this is a far cry from what we see today, from where it started. But when and why did strollers become such an essential item for parents to have on command?

Jen: Curious what Jamie would say about this. That’s answer. I feel like Bugaboo/Uppababy is when they maybe started to take the turn, which would be 15 years ago, 10 years ago, maybe? I kind of equate it to jeans, which is ridiculous, but 20 years ago, no one would pay $200 for a pair of jeans. And nobody would go anywhere other than like Levi’s or The Gap or, or anywhere, and you just bought jeans and that was it.

Now there are, you know, a multitude of denim companies and it’s a thing and you pay $300 for. I mean, not that you can obviously buy them for much cheaper, but it is a much bigger category. And I kind of, obviously the stroller is such a different item, but to me, it kind of follows that same trajectory of this is now a category that has just exploded in the parenting to be world.

I don’t know, Jamie, what do you think? What’s your take on it?

Jamie: I will be 100% in agreement — it’s Bugaboo’s fault. But Bugaboo is how I got into this business when they first came to America. And that was actually back in 2002, 2003. And the original president of Bugaboo, Carrie, her husband ran a PR firm called 72andSunny.

And so she was in Amsterdam and saw this stroller on the street and was like, I need to bring this to America. So she brought it to America, got it on Sex and the City, and then it just blew up. And so that’s when I was hired at Buy Buy Baby, because the need for people to understand how Bugaboo worked was so high that they hired actors, so it was me and a couple other people telling people how the frog folded.

And the Bugaboo company, I think what a lot of people don’t understand is like at its core, the original product was a bike trailer that was designed for an engineering class at their college. And they took this idea of this bike trailer and turned it into a stroller.

And I’ve actually been to their headquarters in Amsterdam and I’ve seen like, all of their strollers over the genesis and you know different versions of like gecko and chameleon and the buffalo and like all of that and it’s wild but it’s all Bugaboo’s fault they created what I have always referred to as like, the stroller renaissance, because nobody paid that much for strollers at that point. And when the Frog first came out, I want to say it was like $ 729 or maybe it was $649 or $729, this was too long ago.But in New York your stroller is your car and it’s how you get around and you pay more money when you’re pushing something all day, because you want it to function better.

And it was also very much a status symbol. It was a huge status symbol. And then that came out at the right time. At a lower price point with a product that was more approachable for consumers.

Rocio: You both touched on a really important point and especially this point about them becoming a status symbol, because they’re so much more now than just a way to travel with babies and go to the grocery store with a baby.

Recently, designer Jeremy Scott, who was formerly the creative director of Moschino, collaborated with Cybex to create the aqua blue stroller. It’s more than $3,000 and was used by Kourtney Kardashian. It’s this whole status symbol and this sort of “loud luxury” in a way. And so why do you think this has happened and how has this evolved, especially in recent years with social media?

Jamie: With Jeremy, it’s different because I’ve actually been at the two release parties for his first and second versions.

The first one was fast food and it had like pizza and like. Hot dogs all over it. And I loved it. A lot of people didn’t, I thought it was cute. Some people were like, this is going to tell our children to eat junk food. But the second one was the black print, the black with the angel wings and things all over it.

You know, and that was the one that people were like, “Oh, this really sticks out.” I think with Jeremy in particular, his style is so like, let’s just say aggressive, let’s say aggressive. Like he designed for Katy Perry. So, if you’re into that visual and what he does, I think some people will be drawn to that.

But I don’t think, and I love Cybex very, very, very much, I don’t think that the designer influenced stuff with Cybex is, like, for the regular consumer.

Rocio: Yeah, it’s more for the Kourtney Kardashians of the world, in a way.

Jen: I think the city aspect, too, like what Jamie was saying earlier about becoming a status symbol.

Like, when you are parenting in a city, you walk everywhere. You do not drive, for the most part. Your stroller, I always say, it’s like your, your donkey, it’s your mule, it carries your groceries, it carries your, you know, change of clothes, it carries your kid’s toys to go to the park. Like, it is on display all the time, and it also has to function, because you are using it multiple times a day for multiple miles. So that, I think, changed things too. I think all of a sudden people were like, “Oh, people are seeing me walking down the street.” It’s kind of like a purse.

Jamie: Yeah, your mattress is not a status symbol. Nobody sees your crib mattress on the sidewalk, you know, with your stroller.

Jen: And then that, I think once that started happening, It sort of then trickled out into the whole country and just sort of became a thing.

Rocio: You both kind of touched on this, but can you discuss some of the most popular or innovative stroller brands and models that we’ve seen in recent years?

Jen: So we actually do a survey at BabyList every year.

It’s called our Best Baby Product Survey, and we send it out to parents to be as well as new parents. We kind of ask them, “What are your favorite baby products and why?” Strollers is obviously a big one. The two most popular that we get back are Uppababy and that’s from last year’s survey. We’re actually doing a new one in August, so it’s a yearly thing.

But those are the two that we hear about probably the most. If you’re going to dig into like niche category, Bumbleride, which I know Jamie loves, I love as well. We do hear a lot about that from the more eco-conscious folks. If you’re looking for like a hybrid, we hear a lot of love for Doona, which is a car seat/stroller combo. Jogging strollers, I would say Bob and Thule are what we hear the most about and then there is a huge portion of people who are buying the Gracos and buying the Britaxes, and buying the Chiccos. Like those are not to be diminished by any means because that is a big chunk but for Uppababy is what we hear the most about in the last year or two.

Jamie: They are like a marketing monster, you know?

Jen: Whenever I go to a new city, I’m always like what, what is everyone pushing? What am I looking at? And I think it depends where, but in most places you’ll see Uppababy. You’ll see Bugaboo still. I feel like Bugaboo has been a little bit taken over by Uppababy depending on where you are.

But you still see a good amount of Bugaboo’s. And then in the suburbs, it’s different. In the suburbs, I see a lot of baby jogger. I see more Graco and Britax and Chicco. I see a lot of Doonas on a daily basis, a lot of Doonas going in and out of the car.

Jamie: Doona has taken a huge chunk of, like, the infant market, because it’s like a, I would say, similar to, like, a snap and go.

And, like, I think people have forgotten snap and go’s exist. Like, you know, it’s always, like, such a good thing when you don’t know what you need for a stroller. It’s like, get a snap and go system, figure out your lifestyle, your daily path, like, what you’re doing, then get a stroller.

Rocio: So you mentioned a lot of different brands and how they’re different in different places, they have different popularity, can you talk a little bit more about what sets the different strollers apart from each other, what sort of features some of those have that appeal to certain audiences versus others?

Jamie: Well, I think the strollers, you know, if we’re going to look at the Bugaboo and the Uppababies of the world, those are really good city strollers. And it doesn’t mean they won’t work and be good for suburban environments, but like I said earlier, like in New York, you’re not in a car, like that’s your all day, everyday. You push it, push it, push it, push it, push it.

You have to have good wheels. You have to have good suspension. And you have to be able to fold it well. Because if you don’t have a place to park it in your entryway or in your apartment. You live in a small apartment in New York, you have to fold it and get it out of the way. So your needs in a city stroller versus needs in suburban where you may just be in and out of your car and like go into the mall or like, you know, HomeGoods to hang out all day — that requires a different, not as like hardcore stroller, if that makes sense? And so a lot of people in the suburbs will get like a different kind of like a Chicco Bravo travel system or something, and then they’ll get like a Bob or a Thule because they also go to the parks and they want like something a little bit more durable. But they don’t require like Bugaboo level.

Jen: Which is so funny because we get asked all the time, I get asked all the time, like, “What is the best stroller? What stroller do I need?” The city folks who don’t live in the city assume that the city folks want the collapsible, you know. “Oh if I have and and obviously if you’re living in like a walk off or you know, oh, you’re gonna be in a crowded space you need a smaller stroller.”

But I find it to be actually the opposite, like city life, like you said, requires the larger — you need the huge storage basket. You need it to be your vehicle. Whereas the suburbs you have a lot more flexibility. I personally don’t want to be lugging an Uppababy in and out of my trunk (I’m in the suburbs now) like five times a day. That is not appealing to me. That being said I have a larger stroller that I keep in my garage versus what I keep in my car. So it is very dependent on needs and that’s something I think a lot of new parents don’t think to think about beforehand. And we always encourage, like, you have to, and we can talk about this later, but you have to think through your lifestyle and your needs and like, what’s good for me isn’t always good for someone else.

Rocio: And so on this same topic, how has the stroller industry responded to changing consumer demands and expectations around their products?

Jamie: I think one of, one of the things that’s been very interesting with stroller evolution in the past few years is this trend of single to double. In terms of like, you know, the Vista and adding a rumble seat, the Vista and the rumble seat, when it first came out, that was like a game changer.

And people are like, “Oh my God, this is amazing.” But like the weight limits only 35 pounds and there is no shade and it only does this. So Uppababy has made changes in that seat over the years, thankfully. But a lot of other companies have come out with these attachable seats now, either as a toddler seat or as a stand on board or ride on board situation.

And what has been interesting is seeing the companies that are able to do like the initial seat and then the add on seat will have a lower weight limit or the same weight limit. And it’s all about like engineering and weight distribution and whatever. Which is that I’m not smart enough to deal with that, but I don’t design these things, but I think the convertible single to double to even triple market has been really interesting because as a consumer, if you are paying a thousand dollars for a stroller, you want it to last, you want it to grow with your family so that it’s adaptable.

So, to me, that’s been one of the more interesting things. And then you have a company like Austlen, for example. And I love that Entourage stroller more than anything. I’ve been a diehard since it first launched and then it disappeared and now it’s back. And that’s one of the coolest strollers I have ever seen in my life. And it’s like a swiss army knife. It does. It’ll hold everything. It’ll hold your suitcases when you go to the airport. I’ve done it and it’s really, really cool. So I think the growth of holding kids and holding cargo, if that makes sense, and that’s been one of the best evolutions in the stroller space.

Jen: I think also travel systems.

We are seeing parents tell us that they want the ease of a travel system. So a travel system is a stroller and a car seat that work together, an infant car seat. You can have a travel system from the same brand. You can also make your own travel system, but you have to use adapters. And not all strollers go with different, if you’re mixing brands, not all go with each other.

It’s been interesting. I’d say over the past two years especially, you used to see more of the travel systems coming from like the Gracos of the world. They were pre-set. You could, you know, run into Target, buy one, be done. Now, I’m seeing a lot of higher end brands. Nuna is really pushing the travel system.

They are mixing and matching. They have a hugely popular car seat, infant Pipa, which they are pairing with all of their strollers. And now could you do that with, you know, you can pair it with anything, but they’re just selling it together and it makes sense. And I think for a lot of parents, they’re not wanting to kind of think through like, “Oh, I don’t want to bother mixing and matching.”

I just, you know, I like this stroller. I’ll just get it with the car seat or I like this car seat, I’ll just get the stroller that goes with it. You didn’t see as a lot of those high end brands doing that, i’d say even two or three years ago. Right? I mean, I think that’s something.

Jamie: It’s only been in the last couple years that they’ve been doing it, even like to bring Bumbleride back up.

Like, they don’t make a car seat. But because they’re eco-forward, they’ve partnered with Clek, and like, you can buy a travel system now with a BumbleRite Indie, and like, call it a day, because their values are in alignment. So, yeah, the better travel systems, I think, are great.

Jen: I would say also just options, too.

People want, they want features, they want options, they want the suspension, they want the big basket, they want a fully reclining seat, they want the modular seat that’s turning forward and backwards, they want the canopy to be able to come all the way down. Thanks, everyone. Those are things you just didn’t get in, like, unless you were spending a lot of money, you weren’t seeing them.

Now you’re seeing them in pretty much across the board and a lot of different brands, even lower priced strollers. You can get a lot of those features. That you only used to be able to get in, say, a Bugaboo or an Uppababy or a Nuna.

Rocio: Could it get overwhelming for parents to have so many options?

Jamie: Oh, yes.

Jen: It’s overwhelming for us and we do this, I’m overwhelmed and I do this for a living. Yes, I think so.

Jamie: Yeah, I mean, when I worked at Buy Buy, I was at Buy Buy Baby for four-and-a-half years and people would come into that store and it was the biggest baby store in the country.

And it was the busiest baby store in the world. Like it was insane, the volume that we dealt with there. But I would see people come down the stairs of the store and see the wall of like McLaren’s and car seats and everything, and just break down and cry because it’s so much, and like your hormones are already going crazy.

And then you there at that point, also like research is a little bit different now, but there are so many options and you don’t know what to look for. And especially now, unfortunately, like, you know, BabyList has this showroom out in California and like, please replicate that here in Denver. I will run it for you.

But there is the retail space is so scary right now for baby. Because all these specialty retailers, a lot of them are closing. And as a consumer, the Buy Buy Baby is gone. The Babies “R” Us is basically gone, even though they’re starting to reopen and whatever, it is not as everywhere as it was. And so you look at Target, which Target is in such a great spot to be able to be this great resource.

But you can’t go in there and pull strollers off the shelves. They’re zip-tied down. And so where do consumers go to get their hands on a stroller and a car seat? I fully believe every other product for the most part you can just buy online and figure out like kind of your aesthetics and what you like, but getting a stroller in your hands and figuring out how it feels.

It’s something you’re going to touch every day all day .You have to get comfortable with it and you have to know your car seat. And I hate that consumers don’t have access to that.

Jen: Yeah, I would agree. So we have a huge selection of product guides that I write a lot of them and we try to fill that gap between the research and the like real life of I need someone next to me saying, “How do I go about even thinking about this?”

Like you said there are — you walk into a store, there’s 50 options in front of you. You do a search for like, best stroller, if you’re narrowing it down by price I mean, there are so many options. We always say, I always say, and I kind of alluded to this before, that you really have to think through your lifestyle.

You have to think about how you’re using it, where you’re using it. Are you in a city? Are you in a walk up building? Are you in an elevator building? Are you in a suburb? Do you drive a car? How many times a day do you drive a car? Do you have another child that you have to take and drop off? And all of those things It’s not hard, it just takes a little time.

You have to really think them through, and once you start answering those questions, the options start to narrow. And then you can maybe be left with three or four or five that you want to go seek out and actually push and find. Because, like I said earlier as well, what works for me isn’t going to necessarily work for somebody else, and that’s okay, right?

Like, I can personally say, and this is also why I dislike the question, “What is the best whatever?”

Jamie: Correct, there’s no such thing.

Jen: Yeah, and in some categories, right, like, I can give you a best overall for a lot of things, but I will always caveat it with, but, like, if you’re this, don’t do this, or if you’re this, don’t do that.

Which is why in our guides, we like to give options, right? It’s not my needs are going to be different than someone else’s needs and just because my best friend loved her Uppababy stroller. And maybe I don’t need the UPPAbaby stroller. Maybe I don’t want the Uppababy. Maybe I don’t want to pay for the Uppababy stroller. Like, you don’t have to be pressured into something just because somebody else has it. So I would say the most important thing is like taking a look at your lifestyle and your needs and then making your decision from there.

Rocio: Yeah, it’s not a one-size-fits-all type of thing. Jen, anything that you would like to see within the stroller industry, any improvements?

Jen: No, I think, I do find it interesting, I was at the ABC Kids show a couple months ago, which is like a big expo of baby gear, and it still blows my mind, like, the amount of features, like, I, like I said. I do this all day, every day, and I am still shocked.

What is left to do? Like, what, and, and there are still things left to do, like the new, I saw this in a few strollers, I saw this in the new Uppababy Vista D3, and I think I saw it in, probably in the Bugaboo Kangaroo, but now they have in-seat suspension, so now we’re not only talking about wheel suspension and suspension on your stroller’s frame, but now my child is not going to bounce because there’s suspension under the seat.

Jamie: Veer has it in the Switchback, too.

Jen: Yes. I’m just like consistently shocked at how many innovations we can come up with.

Jamie: You know what? That, the Veer, that, in terms of innovation, the Switchback, I think that is innovative. That is an innovative product. And, for those of you listening who don’t know what the Switchback is, Veer is a stroller wagon, it’s the Cruiser, it’s wonderful, but they came out with this system that is a seat. And the seat can dock into a four wheel stroller, a three wheel stroller, a bike seat, or a seat for the ground. And it’s really, really cool. Or it turns into a booster seat for like a restaurant. And it’s, to me, that is wildly innovative. And now they have the coolers. And the coolers can snap into the stroller.

Jen: Oh, I thought of one more. The Grand Prix from Baby Jogger. It’s a trail. Did you see that? It, you probably saw it at ABC too. It’s a jogging stroller that then converts into a bike trailer, which is definitely only for a certain type of parent, right? Like not everybody needs a jogging stroller that turns into a bike trailer.

But what I thought was interesting about it is when I was talking to the person at Baby Jogger, she was saying like a lot of people, a lot of parents know that they want to do something with their baby once they come. Something active, right? Like I want to either run or bike, or I want to do something.

I’m not quite sure what it is. This allows you to buy the stroller and then you can convert it into a trailer. So down the road, if you do end up saying like, “I’m the type of person who really likes getting out running and getting outside with my baby.” I now have that optionality to turn this into a trailer, you don’t have to buy a separate kit. It’s expensive. It’s heavy. Like there’s definitely, like, there’s, nothing’s perfect yet. But this idea that like, I’m not sure what i’m gonna want but maybe if I’m going to spend all this money, at least I have the option to then do other things with it. I thought that was really interesting, and that’s similar to like other, where you’re opening up, like, yes, you’re spending a lot, but you’re getting a lot from it.

And I think that’s something we hear from parents too, like, if I’m going to spend all this money, I want it to be a multi use product. And you’re seeing that more and more, which I like.

Jamie: I would also add the rise of the stroller wagons to that, because the stroller wagons over the past few years, They, they have saturated the market for a lot of reasons, which would be a whole other podcast to be honest, but I do think there’s some really cool stuff coming in the stroller wagon category that’s very interesting and a lot of it legally I cannot discuss, so.

Rocio: Okay, well, we know that there is a lot for parents and future parents to look forward to in this space. And what is the number one piece of advice each of you would give to new parents who are looking to purchase their first stroller?

Jamie: Don’t fall into the, “I’m gonna get it because my friends do” trap. I think that is the hardest thing.

And thankfully there are resources like BabyList and like, I think I spend all day on social media right now when I’m not on the road with like speaking events, but answering questions for people. But with strollers you really just have to do some research and figure it out. And you will never just have one stroller.

Jen: Yeah, I was actually going to say exactly the same thing. So back to what I said before, know your lifestyle, know the way you’re going to use it. Don’t be influenced by what you see everyone else using to a point, right? I mean, it’s great to ask. Other parents are a great resource. Never underestimate like people who are in the trenches and who are dealing with it can tell you a lot more than like watching a video or reading a blurb from a brand.

But think through your lifestyle and your needs, because at the end of the day you’re the one who’s going to be using it and you need to put in a little work up front to make sure you’re making the right choice. That’s what I would say. And then yeah, I hate to say like you’re gonna need more than one stroller but most families you can start with one.

I also. I like to tell people who are registering, you don’t need them all up front and you don’t need to put three of them on your registry because that’s really overwhelming. And I get that. Start with one, start with the one you’re going to use every day. As you get more comfortable, as your baby gets a little older, you can then go into, “Do I need a travel stroller? How often do I travel? Should I get a, you know, super fancy one or can I get by with a 100 travel stroller?” Which, there are plenty of those options. “Do I jog? Do I walk on a, you know, off the beaten path kind of trail on a daily basis?” Maybe you want a jogger. You probably will need more than one. But don’t get overwhelmed with it in the beginning.

Rocio: Great. Thank you both so much for joining us. This was a really great talk. I know I learned a lot. I’m sure our listeners learned a lot about strollers —more than they could have even imagined. Jen LaBracio is senior gear editor at BabyList. Jamie Grayson is The Baby Guy. This episode was produced by Podcast FastTrack with additional support from Jason Rossum, Amy Perry, Liliana Zapata, Juan Palacios and Lorena Caro.

Our theme music is by Taka Yasuzawa and Alex Suguira. If you like what you heard, please subscribe on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Amazon Music, or wherever you’re listening. Tell your friends about us. Know someone who’s considering the Ella Smart stroller? Share this episode with them.

Then head to qz.com/Obsession to sign up for Quartz’s weekly obsession email and browse hundreds of interesting backstories. I’m Rocio Fabbro. Thanks for listening.

Credits

The Quartz Obsession is produced by Podcast Fast Track, with additional support from Jason Russum, Amy Perry, Liliana Zapata, Juan Palacios, and Lorena Caro. Our theme music is by Taka Yasuzawa and Alex Suguira. This episode was recorded at G/O Media headquarters in New York.

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A global mood swing. A survey from Bank America shows that investor sentiment is bouncing back to pre-Liberation-Day levels (but mostly overseas) and that recession fears are dropping.

AI’d like a lawyer? OpenAI is reportedly considering whether to accuse Microsoft of anticompetitive behavior as the future of their partnership hangs in the balance.

Enlisting OpenAI’s bots. The Defense Department just awarded a one-year, $200 million defense contract to the ChatGPT-maker for “frontier AI capabilities.” 

Prime cuts coming. Amazon CEO Andy Jassy said in a company-wide email that AI will bump up the company’s efficiency and productivity — but likely decrease its headcount.

A factory reset. Chipmaker Intel will reportedly lay off up to 20% of its factory workforce in what the CEO called “difficult actions but essential to meet our affordability challenges.”

Tesla gets Cyberstuck again. The company’s stock slumped on news that Cybertruck and Model Y production will be suspended at its Austin plant for a week — the third pause in the past year.

Hold, please

The Federal Reserve began its June meeting Tuesday with interest rates expected to stay exactly where they are: elevated and immovable. Markets are betting on a less-than-1% chance of a cut.

The (likely) decision to hold rates steady puts the Fed squarely at odds with President Donald Trump, who has made his position on monetary policy characteristically loud and clear — calling Fed Chair Jerome Powell a “FOOL,” among other insults. But Powell, a Trump appointee, isn’t budging. Inflation may be down from its peak, but it’s still above the Fed’s 2% target. The Fed worries that if it cuts rates too soon, it could trigger another inflationary spiral… just as Americans are unclenching their wallets.

Meanwhile, the economic mood board is decidedly mixed. GDP dipped in Q1 and might do so again in Q2, job growth is slow, and consumer confidence is recovering from its April slump — a.k.a. “Liberation Day,” when Trump announced his wave of tariffs — but remains shaky.

The president wants rate cuts now — to stimulate growth, boost markets, and take pressure off his economy. But Powell is playing the long game. He’s reluctant to repeat the Fed’s 2021 mistake, when it underestimated inflation’s staying power and moved too slowly to correct course. This time, he’s doing the opposite: refusing to move too quickly.

It’s a delicate position.

Powell risks damaging the labor market if rates stay high for too long. But he could risk something bigger — the Fed’s credibility — if he caves to political pressure. When Trump last floated the idea of firing Powell, the market dropped 1,000 points. Investors, it seems, prefer a Fed that acts like it is above politics, even if it means sitting on its hands through some turbulence. Quartz’s Catherine Baab has more on how the Fed is holding firm while markets are holding their breath. 

Deductions, deductions, deductions

Senate Republicans just dropped their version of Trump’s sprawling tax-and-spending megabill — all 549 pages of it — setting off a phase of negotiations that could determine the size, shape, and shelf life of the next generation of GOP tax policy.

The proposal aims to extend Trump’s 2017 tax cuts and pay for them with steep reductions to safety net programs such as Medicaid and clean energy tax credits. The legislation leans into Trump’s campaign-season promises (No taxes on tips! Deductions for overtime! Bigger breaks for seniors!) — though most of those perks vanish in 2028, just as his term expires.

The Senate’s version includes stricter income phaseouts than the House-passed version and delegates enforcement details to the Treasury Department. Another key difference? Permanence. While the House bill took a short-term approach to tax extenders, Senate Republicans are aiming to make several key business breaks permanent, including immediate expensing of capital investments and full deductions for R&D.

In a departure from earlier GOP efforts, the Senate plan doesn’t entirely go scorched earth on Biden-era clean energy programs. Instead, the plan is giving solar, wind, nuclear, and geothermal projects more time before the plug is pulled — while quietly phasing out EV tax credits and adding protections to keep Chinese components out of clean-energy supply chains.

Negotiations with the House will be tense. The math is tight. The rhetoric will be looser. And if nothing else, this guarantees one thing: The next few weeks on Capitol Hill will be loud, long, and lousy with tax metaphors. Quartz’s Joseph Zeballos-Roig has more on how the tax bill became a policy Rorschach.

More from Quartz

🚙 Mitsubishi is raising its prices (2.1%, on average) due to U.S. tariffs

✈️ JetBlue is cutting flights as it expects to lose big this year

💻 Microsoft says no more 9 to 5; hello, “infinite workday”

📦 Amazon is doubling Prime Days — as consumers pull back on spending

🔴 Kraft Heinz will remove artificial dyes from its U.S. food products by 2027

🏡 These states are where homeownership will be most out of reach in a decade

Our best wishes on a safe start to the day. Send any news, comments, and more to [email protected].

Tesla’s Austin factory will pause production of its Cybertruck and Model Y vehicles the week of June 30, Business Insider reported. Workers were told the shutdown would be for maintenance on the production lines, to ensure future optimization. 

Shares of the EV company slumped 4% on the news. While such a pause is routine for many automakers, particularly in summer, this is the third time Tesla has done so in the past 12 months: once in May, when workers attended seminars on company morale, and once in December, due to a battery shortage. For this latest pause, employees have the option of either taking paid time off or coming in for voluntary training — and to help with cleaning. 

The production pause comes after Tesla’s first-quarter numbers were dismal. A new Model Y in January was expected to provide a boost, but sales were at their lowest since 2022, a 13% year-over-year decline. Some of the lower sales numbers are attributed to consumer boycotts in the wake of Elon Musk’s controversial role in President Donald Trump’s administration. Last month, Tesla shareholders wrote Musk an open letter demanding that he do his actual job.

The company also issued a massive recall of Cybertrucks in March because their exterior trim panels could easily be dislodged and cause traffic hazards.

Meanwhile, Tesla is preparing to launch its Model Y robotaxis in Austin on June 22, after almost a decade of Musk promising that such a launch was imminent.

Tesla’s second-quarter results are expected in July. 

Amazon CEO Andy Jassy had a message for the company’s corporate workforce on Tuesday: The AI era is here — and while it’s going to make things faster and more efficient, it’s also going to mean fewer humans in the loop.

In a company-wide memo, Jassy said Amazon’s deepening investment in generative AI won’t just reinvent customer experiences — it will change the way the company operates internally. And, over time, that likely will mean fewer white-collar jobs. 

“As we roll out more Generative AI and agents, it should change the way our work is done,” Jassy wrote. “We will need fewer people doing some of the jobs that are being done today and more people doing other types of jobs. It’s hard to know exactly where this nets out over time, but in the next few years, we expect that this will reduce our total corporate workforce as we get efficiency gains from using AI extensively across the company.”

Under Jassy, Amazon has already shown that it’s not afraid to make cuts. Since late 2022, the company has laid off more than 27,000 employees, part of a wave of post-pandemic belt-tightening that has swept across Big Tech. Now, even as revenue bounces back and capital spending surges, a hiring rebound hasn’t followed — especially not for corporate roles.

Jassy’s comments suggest that’s by design. Even beyond the office, Amazon’s workforce is flattening: The company now deploys more than 750,000 robots across its fulfillment network, and its latest model, “Vulcan,” is designed to handle heavier loads once managed by human hands.

At the same time, Amazon is rapidly embedding AI across nearly every part of its operations. More than 1,000 generative AI tools are already live or in development. Alexa is being retooled as “Alexa+,” a smarter assistant that can take action rather than just respond to prompts. On the shopping side, new features such as “Lens” (visual search), “Buy for Me” (cross-site purchasing), and automated sizing recommendations are being rolled out. The company’s generative AI shopping assistant is, according to Jassy, being used by tens of millions of customers.

Under the hood, AI is driving Amazon’s fulfillment strategy: managing inventory, forecasting demand, and working on robot efficiency. Customer service chatbots are getting an AI overhaul, and product listings are increasingly auto-generated. But the real breakthrough, according to Jassy, is the emergence of AI “agents” — software assistants capable of scouring the web, writing code, finding anomalies, and even handling research. 

“There will be billions of these agents, across every company and in every imaginable field,” he wrote. “There will also be agents that routinely do things for you outside of work, from shopping to travel to daily chores and tasks. Many of these agents have yet to be built, but make no mistake, they’re coming, and coming fast.”

But perhaps the most telling part of Jassy’s vision is in an “agentic” future — one where AI software agents will handle much of the legwork that once filled certain jobs. The CEO thinks research, summarization, anomaly detection, translation, coding, and more will soon be delegated to bots that get smarter over time, leaving humans to “focus less on rote work and more on thinking strategically.” 

“Agents will allow us to start almost everything from a more advanced starting point,” he wrote, adding that they’ll “change the scope and speed at which we can innovate for customers.”

Jassy encouraged employees to “get more done with scrappier teams,” attend training sessions, and adopt an AI-first mindset. In his words, those who embrace AI and help Amazon build its future will be “well-positioned to have high impact and help us reinvent the company.”

Jassy has floated this ethos before.

In his April shareholder letter, the CEO urged Amazon to operate like the “world’s largest startup” — prioritizing speed, invention, and risk-taking over headcount and hierarchy. Tuesday’s memo sharpened that idea: In an AI-driven workplace, fewer people may be part of the equation.

Amazon is far from alone. Microsoft and Google have both leaned into AI while slowing hiring and cutting thousands of roles. Startups like Harvey and Adept are pitching AI agents as the future of office work. And Anthropic CEO Dario Amodei recently warned AI could wipe out 50% of entry-level jobs and drive unemployment up by as much as 20% within five years. Others, including Nvidia’s Jensen Huang and billionaire Paul Tudor Jones, have argued that the shift will improve job quality and create new kinds of work — but even they acknowledge it will require significant retraining and regulatory oversight.

For now, Amazon is moving fast, scaling AI across its business — and signaling that headcount growth is no longer a prerequisite for progress.

Investor sentiment is back — well, at least, among global fund managers. According to Bank of America’s June 2025 Global Fund Manager Survey, optimism has has swelled to pre‑tariff‑shock levels, wiping out the dips stirred by President Donald Trump’s “Liberation Day” tariffs.

The headline numbers pack a punch: 66% of fund managers now anticipate a “soft landing” for the global economy, up from 37% in April. And while 82% of respondents in April predicted weakening growth, only 46% hold that view in June. That’s the largest two-month sentiment swing since last year’s presidential election. Recession fears have diminished drastically — now, 36% of respondents think a downturn is "unlikely."

So what’s behind this mood swing? The survey, which was conducted from June 6 to June 12 and captures responses from 190 fund managers overseeing over $520 billion in assets, says diffusing trade tensions, rolled-back and somewhat stabilizing tariffs (expected by about 75% of investors to be an average of 15% or lower), and better-than-feared U.S. economic data are the big factors. 

This resurgence in confidence is reflected in a significant shift in investment strategies. Fund managers are lowering cash allocations to a three‑month low while boosting positions in emerging‑market equities, energy, banks — and leaning especially into Eurozone stocks, supported by a recent Germany fiscal stimulus.

But there’s a twist.

While the world warms up, sentiment toward U.S. assets is increasingly bearish. The U.S. dollar is now the most underweighted currency in at least 20 years, making it one of the hottest “crowded trades,” alongside gold and tech. The dollar index has tumbled nearly 9.6 % this year, and more than half (54%) of fund managers predict international stocks will outperform U.S. equities over the next five years.

Concerns over the sustainability of U.S. fiscal policy are also prevalent, with 81% expecting recent spending bills to significantly add to national debt. Treasury yields are predicted to climb, possibly reaching 5%.

So while confidence largely rebounds abroad, it’s cooling off at home. The latest survey paints a clear picture: Global capital is rotating out of U.S. assets and chasing upside in Europe and emerging markets. Risk appetite is back — but it’s looking outward. Fund managers are shedding cash, leaning into higher-beta plays overseas. The bull case is building, but so are the tail risks — shaky fiscal paths, geopolitical sparks, and a market still on edge.

The price of Mitsubishi cars will rise 2.1% on average, the Japanese carmaker said Tuesday.

Mitsubishi temporarily suspended deliveries to U.S. dealers after President Donald Trump's announcement of sweeping tariffs in April, but resumed doing so last week, Reuters reports. The company said the new price hikes, which take effect on Wednesday, would not apply to any vehicles currently in dealers’ showrooms. 

A company spokesperson said that Mitsubishi "regularly reviews vehicle pricing in order to ensure we are in line with segment expectations and the latest market trends.

"Based on our most recent evaluation across the industry," the spokesperson said, Mitsubishi "will revise the Manufacturer’s Suggested Retail Price (MSRP) on select 2025 vehicles, effective June 18. There will be no adjustments to vehicles already in dealer inventory.”

Mitsubishi has had a strong 18-month performance: Its 2024 sales were up 26%, to 110,000, its best performance since 2019. And 2025 looks just as promising, with sales up 11% in the first three months of the year. The company will soon reveal updates to the new Outlander model and a new EV scheduled for 2026. 

Last week, Trump mused about hiking tariffs again, ostensibly to onshore more U.S. production. Yet auto tariffs have been enormously unpopular with the auto industry. Mitsubishi is not the first to hike prices: Both Subaru and Ford did so by as much as $2,000.

In March, the S&P Global downgraded its 2025 forecast for U.S. vehicle sales by 700,000. 

Meanwhile, Fitch Ratings data shows that the number of subprime automobile borrowers who are at least 60 days past due on their loans rose to 6.56%, the highest number since the agency began collecting data in 1994.

The rising delinquencies point to fundamental economic weaknesses, according to Mariano Torras, an economics professor at Adelphi University. He says what is happening among subprime auto borrowers is the “canary in the coal mine” and that the problems in subprime auto loans are likely to spread to other parts of the economy.

—Kevin Williams contributed to this article. 

Correction: An earlier version of this story misstated what Mitsubishi said about price increases. The company said it "regularly reviews vehicle pricing," and that the price hikes were in line with its "most recent evaluation across the industry." Mitsubishi did not say it was raising prices as a result of tariffs.

Intel is reported to be laying off up to 20% of its factory workforce as the struggling chipmaker tries to turn its business around.

“These are difficult actions but essential to meet our affordability challenges and current financial position of the company," Intel Vice President Naga Chandrasekaran wrote in a letter to employees obtained by Oregon Live, detailing that the company will make the 15% to 20% cut on factory jobs in July.

The company, which did not immediately return a request for comment, told the paper in a statement that “removing organizational complexity and empowering our engineers will enable us to better serve the needs of our customers and strengthen our execution." It did not comment on the specifics or reasons for the cuts.

In April, Intel had announced that it planned to purge 20% of its staff to pare back bureaucracy within the company, which would leave more than 20,000 people without a job. It wasn't immediately clear if the factory cuts are part of those plans or a separate downsizing initiative.

The previous layoff announcement was the first major action undertaken by chip veteran Lip-Bu Tan, who took the helm as Intel’s CEO earlier this year.

“Under my leadership, Intel will be an engineering-focused company. We will listen closely and act on your input. Most importantly, we will create products that solve your problems and drive your success,” Tan said in March.

The company has been struggling to keep pace with competitors like Nvidia, which replaced Intel on the Dow Jones Industrial Average in November 2024.

The company has also been the target of possible acquisitions and has been working with investment bankers at Morgan Stanley and Goldman Sachs to right its business, including by potentially splitting its foundry division.

The chipmaker’s struggles have even caught the eye of President Donald Trump, who, according to Bloomberg, reported that Taiwanese contract manufacturer TSMC (TSM) is considering taking a controlling stake in chipmaker Intel’s factories at the request of Trump.

Trump’s team raised the idea of a deal between the two firms in recent meetings with officials from TSMC, and they were receptive, Bloomberg reported, citing a person familiar with the matter.

—Kevin Williams and Ece Yildirim contributed to this article.

JetBlue does not expect to break even this year due to falling travel demand. The company is also cutting costs by axing some off-peak flights. 

CEO Joanna Geraghty told staff that “even a recovery won’t fully offset the ground we’ve lost this year and our path back to profitability will take longer than we’d hoped,” in an internal memo on Monday, CNBC reports. “That means we’re still relying on borrowed cash to keep the airline running.” 

JetBlue is hardly alone; many airlines are citing a lack of consumer confidence in 2025 due to macro economic uncertainty, with fewer bookings even as fares plummeted. The domestic market is oversupplied, and several large airlines cut back their growth plans for the second half of the year.

JetBlue hasn’t posted a profit since 2019. Starting in 2021, it spent three years pursing a merger with Spirit Airlines, which was shot down in March 2024 when a federal judge blocked the deal. Geraghty had just stepped into the CEO job a month before; she called the Spirit affair a major “distraction.” Last August, JetBlue took on $2.75 billion in debt.

Cost-cutting measures will involve examining unprofitable routes, pausing plans to retrofit some older jets with new interiors, and reassess hiring plans, according to Geraghty’s memo. But the mid-range airline still plans to move ahead with offering premium experiences on high-demand flights to attract more business travelers.

Last month, a new partnership with United Airlines enabled cross-booking and shared frequent-flyer rewards.

Senate Republicans released their tax portion of President Trump’s megabill on Tuesday afternoon, kicking off what’s expected to be an intense period of negotiations to send the final version of the measure through the House and onto the White House.

The 549-page bill would extend the bulk of the GOP’s 2017 signature tax cuts, financed with steep cuts to safety net programs like Medicaid and clean energy tax credits.

“It powers the economy by permanently extending critical pro-growth provisions and introduces new incentives for domestic investment, providing certainty for American job creators to spur domestic economic activity and invest in their workers,” Senate Finance Chair Mike Crapo said in a statement accompanying the legislation.

Republican senators are racing to pass their megabill using a party-line reconciliation process to overcome united Democratic opposition. Here are 5 takeaways.

Trump’s campaign promises to get rid of taxes on tips and overtime pay are still in

The Senate GOP legislation includes Trump’s campaign promises to eliminate taxes on tips and overtime pay. It also would establish a tax deduction on auto loan interest and a larger standard deduction for seniors aged 65 and above. The latter is meant to replace a Trump promise to eliminate taxes on Social Security benefits. All would expire at the end of Trump’s term in 2028.

The House-passed tax-and-spending bill had identical measures, but GOP senators put more limits, presumably to cut the final price tag. On getting rid of tax on tips, the GOP bill would set up a maximum $25,000 deduction that starts phasing out at $150,000 for singles and $300,000 for couples. It applies for occupations that usually receive cash tips, such as bartenders or waitresses. A list of specified jobs that apply for the tax break will be released by the Treasury Department within three months of the bill being signed into law.

When it comes to no tax on overtime pay, the GOP legislation establishes a deduction that peaks at $12,500 for singles, and $25,000 for those filing joint tax returns. It has a larger phase out that begins at $150,000 for singles and $300,000 for couples filing jointly.

Republican senators opted for permanence over short ladders 

GOP senators are keen to restore a set of business tax breaks that expired three years ago and make them permanent. Past efforts to revive them in bipartisan negotiations failed, despite the support the provisions also attracted from Democrats and influential business groups.

The three business tax provisions include extending rules allowing companies to deduct the capital expense costs immediately, instead of spreading them over years; establishing a bigger interest deduction; and restoring the ability for businesses to immediately write off research and development expenses.

“Holding the ultimate cost of the bill constant, making these three provisions permanent is critical to achieving the growth needed to bring in more revenue,” George Callas, once a senior tax aide to former House Speaker Paul Ryan and currently with advocacy group Arnold Ventures, wrote on X.

Other provisions such as scholarship tax credits are also made permanent, in contrast to the House GOP’s short-ladder approach. “It's not just the business extenders: there's a lot more permanency in the Senate tax bill across the board,” said Andrew Lautz, a tax expert at the Bipartisan Policy Center.

Biden’s climate-era programs get a longer shelf life (for now)

Some GOP senators are hesitant to immediately scrap clean energy tax credits that Democrats approved under former President Joe Biden. That skepticism was channeled into the Senate GOP tax bill.

Senate Republicans would give wind and solar projects more time to qualify for the credits and not shut them off abruptly. The bill is also friendlier to geothermal, nuclear, and hydropower projects, while imposing new limits to prevent Chinese products from entering U.S. supply chains.

Still, other clean energy measures are eliminated outright. The $7,500 clean vehicle credit expires six months after the bill is enacted.

'Trump accounts' for newborns are left unchanged and modestly increase child tax credit

One big GOP priority hasn’t been changed from the House bill. The Senate GOP bill would establish a tax-preferred savings account with a $1,000 contribution from the federal government for children born during Trump’s term, known as "Trump accounts." They’re able to access the cash for certain purposes after turning 18, and have full control of the money at the age of 30.

Senate Republicans would increase the child tax credit to $2,200 and make it permanent. It’s a modest increase from the current level of $2,000, which is set to revert back to $1,000 at the end of this year if Congress doesn’t step in.

GOP senators low-balled House Republicans on SALT

Republican senators drastically scaled back a $40,000 limit on the state and local tax deduction, a provision allowing individuals or married couples to subtract the amount paid in state tax from their federal tax bill. Republicans put the limit in place to help finance the 2017 tax cuts, and most of the SALT deduction flows to high-earners in predominantly Democratic states.

SALT had been the center of tense negotiations in the lower chamber and the policy changes triggered anger among Republicans hailing from states like New York. GOP Rep. Mike Lawler of New York called the SALT changes “dead on arrival” in an X post.

If you feel like you're working from the moment you wake up to the time you go to sleep, you aren't alone.

According to new analysis from Microsoft, more and more office workers are experiencing an "infinite workday," where they are online or doing some form of work from morning to night.

Analyzing data from the 365 suite, Microsoft found that the workday starts earlier than ever, with 40% of people already online and reviewing emails at 6 a.m. That's probably because the average worker using 365 receives 117 emails and 153 Teams messages per workday.

The company also found that it's hard for workers to get much done between 9 and 5, with 57% of meetings called in the moment without a calendar invite. Plus, most workers have only two minutes of focus time before being interrupted by a meeting, email, or message during those core work hours.

Microsoft revealed that "meetings hijack prime focus time," since 50% of meetings take place from 9-11 a.m. and 1-3 p.m., which is when research has shown people are mostly able to be productive.

And after 5 p.m., things aren't looking better, with the workday increasingly bleeding into evenings and weekdays. Data show that 29% of active employees check their emails again around 10 p.m. and the average worker sends or receives 50 Teams messages outside of core work hours each day.

Microsoft also saw a 16% year-over-year increase in evening meetings and reported that 20% of workers are actively working over the weekend.

The company said its data "points to a larger truth: the modern workday for many has no clear start or finish."

"As business demands grow more complex and expectations continue to rise, time once reserved for focus or recovery may now be spent catching up, prepping, and chasing clarity," Microsoft said. "It's the professional equivalent of needing to assemble a bike before every ride. Too much energy is spent organizing chaos before meaningful work can begin. "